Speaker 1: 0:00

Welcome back to You're Always Fine a space to show up for yourself and embrace the mess that lives underneath. Because, let's be real, it's exhausting always being fine. So grab your headphones and allow yourself to listen, laugh and even cry, because you're not alone and we aren't always fine, and that's okay.

Speaker 2: 0:23

Hey Beeps, I'm your host, Christine, and I'm Teresa. All right, TC, I would like to tell you a little story today. Okay, so, once upon a time there was this girl and she was okay. You know she had some self-esteem issues, you know she had some family stuff going on. But she then met, you know, her Prince Charming, and he came and he swept her off her feet and gave her confidence and he proposed and everyone was like, you know, they faced a little adversity there. They got married and they lived happily ever after.

Speaker 3: 1:04

There's a fairy tale we're talking about.

Speaker 2: 1:07

Yes, this is a classic fairy tale story, and the reason I'm bringing it up is because I think that from a very young age, that's kind of what we're taught about marriage and or like relationships.

Speaker 3: 1:23

Oh, yeah, that's like what all the Disney movies. Yeah, it's like what all the Disney movies were.

Speaker 2: 1:27

Right, someone's gonna come to save you. And then you know happily and end they lived happily ever after.

Speaker 3: 1:36

Correct.

Speaker 2: 1:38

Someone lied to us.

Speaker 3: 1:39

Yeah, lies, liars. What dream are they selling us?

Speaker 2: 1:44

No, that sounds horrible. It sounds horrible but seriously, like I'm not even getting into yet around, like what is modeled in your household and marriage and like that effect on you know relationships and marriage, but just like, just fundamentally it feels off right when you start thinking about it.

Speaker 3: 2:00

Yeah, I feel like you sell that to people and that's why people don't last, because that's what they expect, and it isn't like that.

Speaker 2: 2:08

So, if you haven't guessed, today we are getting into marriage and the incredible amount of work it takes to keep a marriage alive. Of course, every relationship. What specifically, today we're diving into marriage?

Speaker 3: 2:23

Yes, we are, let's go.

Speaker 2: 2:25

Let's do it All right, so happily ever after the best day of your life, right? I just I remember thinking this one. I got married. It was, it was one of the best days. But man, talk about a poor outlook or like a dreary outlook when you think about, like, if that was the best day of my marriage, yeah, that's kind of right, like I don't know, don't you think that?

Speaker 3: 2:54

Yeah, I think that mentality I don't know, not showing the hard parts of marriage, not like being realistic, I don't know. To me it's not realistic. Like sometimes you see on Instagram and Facebook and look, I love my husband, I love him, but like if you don't want to kill your person every once in a while, I just don't think your relationship is real. Like I just don't think it's real.

Speaker 2: 3:17

Well and also right. I think so many things right Also. No marriage is gonna save you. You have to save yourself. The crazy part is the person that I was back in 2017 when I got married is nowhere new. The person I am today, oh yeah, major difference. But yeah, your thing that is kind of crazy when you think about like you are expected to, like right To have and to hold, and sickness and health and all those things.

Speaker 2: 3:42

But I'm not sure Kerry would have chosen this version of me and like there's been times where I'm like I wouldn't have chose this version of you. Yeah, I'm not going anywhere, but like I can tell you like this era of your life, like I wouldn't have looked twice, kind of thing.

Speaker 3: 3:59

Yeah, Well, I think that's why it's. I think that's why people give up, because you're sold like this idea that everything's perfect, you guys are gonna be exactly who you are, and then, like 10 years later, that's just not even possible. Like, if you just look at your own life, right, like before marriage, I am not when I was 16 and then 26. Like I mean I was married by that point, but like I was not the same, I'm not the same person, thank God. Like if I was the same person I was when I was 16, like it just wouldn't. I don't even know if I'd be alive.

Speaker 3: 4:33

Like you know, like there's just a lot of growth that you make and that's why it's really important to like have a realistic view of marriage and go into it with, like the idea that, okay, the core values of my person I really, really love. Like I know they're gonna change, I know we're gonna grow, hopefully we can do that together, but like to go in it with this idea that you're never gonna argue, you're never gonna fight, you guys aren't gonna change in some ways. That may be difficult for the other person, it's just not realistic and I think that's why people quit and give up and don't fight for each other.

Speaker 2: 5:05

And you know, I think it's so interesting because I've always said that I think that marriages don't break down because there's a lack of love. I firmly believe that marriages break down because there's a lack of communication. Or, you know, we start to somehow get off right, Like off the same page, or you. A way that used to work to communicate no longer works. So, I'm not sure if you experienced this when you know. You guys were faced like everything was Owen was happening and oh yeah.

Speaker 3: 5:43

Well, when you throw kids into the mix also, it's like another complicated, like layer, because you're used to going from just each other and, like you know, coming home from work, whatever you are each other the honeymoon phase, yeah, like the honeymoon phase, like it's just you guys and then you bring kids into it and it's like you automatically see less of each other or just the quality time is different, and it's an adjustment.

Speaker 3: 6:12

And I think it's definitely adjustment in terms of like men do the best that they can to understand it, but like when you're a mom and you have your children, like they just kind of take a front seat, especially in the beginning, because they can't fend for themselves, and that's an adjustment. Like I know that that was difficult for Mike and I it was, it was hard.

Speaker 2: 6:35

Well, so right, it's hard. And then I think that what happens there is like the way you guys used to communicate or show love then changes, and then that gap just kind of keeps growing. I mean.

Speaker 2: 6:45

Terry and I saw that happen to us when I got sick. You know she has always been a big supporter, but everything like she would say what it did that used to maybe be fine, such as like I love, I miss when you cook for me. I miss doing this for me. I took that as a complete slight against me.

Speaker 2: 7:04

She was trying to express something which is like something she missed, that this disease took away from her. But all I felt was guilt and then there was never been an anger towards her from that. And so, like, all I did was like widen this gap and it took quite literally us Like. I remember, like we wrote an entire workbook essentially about how to reconnect after like tragedy or something happens, because you know again a different era, you're different people and like, what used to work doesn't work and you have to just like anything right, you have to figure out what you're going to do about that. And I think sometimes we get comfortable in marriage and we just like, are like, definitely we don't put that effort in.

Speaker 3: 7:43

Yeah, and in terms of like, let's even talk about like, love languages and stuff like that. Those also.

Speaker 3: 7:50

I know, I know those also can change. Like like okay, mike's love language has always been like physical affection, like that's just how he is, and I used to be like that. But now I have kids and they're touching me all the time. So I'm like about a time he gets home from work I'm like just don't touch me. But for me it's become because there's more on my plate, there's more to do with the kids. For me it's like acts of service, like if I see you doing the dishes, if I see you sweeping the floor, if I see you loading the laundry, okay, without you having to ask yeah. Like let's okay, we're good, let's go. You know what I mean.

Speaker 3: 8:34

So you also have to understand that that can change and there's factors that cause that. And that was a little hard for him. He was like I don't understand and it's funny, he'll do the walking by butt slap. And I have a love-hey relationship with that. Sometimes I like it, sometimes I don't. So, like you have to just figure out, like along the way, like what is changing, and just like adapt. But a lot of people don't wanna do that because it's work.

Speaker 2: 9:04

Exactly it's work. Now, you know I wasn't gonna go here because I know I have a very strong hot take on love languages and so, but here, but we have arrived.

Speaker 3: 9:15

So I will We've arrived.

Speaker 2: 9:19

I hate the love languages. But before everyone comes to me in the comments and everything else, please hear me out. I hate the love languages mostly because I think that it was a great tool that was like given for relationships to get people to understand better. However, one let's not get into the fact there's not that much empirical evidence around like the substantial thing. But also I think it then has become a little bit more like you can only have one of the five and the reality of it is it's so many more than five love languages. And also I don't think it does a great job of helping you to understand that most of the time you give what you would like to receive and I don't think it does enough to like walk people through, to get them like.

Speaker 2: 10:07

People use it as this great tool and I think it falls short and it doesn't like serve people enough, you know, and so that's my issue with it. So it's not really like the id or what it's trying to do. I just think it becomes over. It's an overgeneralization, as I guess most theories are. But if you don't write, like you said, acts of service, right, acts of service are great, but most people don't want that act of service after they have to ask for it, right? Correct.

Speaker 2: 10:36

And then it gets into though the fact of like one of the biggest things I see I've seen in my own marriage. I have to constantly stop myself and I see it in all the couples I do. We are under the assumption that if you love me, you would just do this and if you care about me you would stop doing this and like that's mind reading. That is games. That is so incredibly toxic for your relationship or marriage to do that. You know you just brought it up with the butt slaps A great example, right. So you've just said that sometimes you like it and sometimes you don't. So if you were to say, if you love me, you stop doing that, Right, and I kind of love to that, See about how crazy that would be. But sometimes he's allowed to do it and that can like benefit him. But right, it's confusing and there and nobody's gonna be able to do it. It's very confusing.

Speaker 2: 11:26

Every single second of every single day, when you're also constantly changing Right.

Speaker 3: 11:31

Well, and like that scenario, like we've him and I have talked about that before because he's like I like it's like the notebook scene what do you want, what do you want? So we talked about that and I was like I have to do a better job at communicating with him and he has to do a better job of, like, assessing the situation. You know, like, like be a little bit more cognizant of what is happening around. Like I would just like you, like I know you love me, I would like you to just think about, like okay, right now she's got two kids wrapped around her ankles, she is loading the dishwasher. She looks stressed. Will this butt slap be well received, like you know? So that, I think, is a way of like I need to communicate better and he also needs to kind of like assess the situation and I think, when you do it that way, rather than saying if you love me, you'll do this, like it's just an easier way to grow and an easier way to positively feed off of each other.

Speaker 2: 12:34

One to your point. Right there too, I think that in most households, right whether you have children or not, there becomes a like default either adult or default parent. And I think a lot of times we enable that behavior right, like I have enabled it so that my wife literally gets a piece of paper. It could be like you're the greatest ever and she'd be like, oh, that's adult paperwork, and she'll hand it right to me. I'm like, did you read the paper? Like, did you like this? And so right, I think, too, it's so important to realize that, like, if you do not, if you never show your spouse like that is stressful to have two kids around you, or like what you do is stressful, and you are constantly just kind of like creating this idealic situation for, like the family unit, well then, how would he ever know when they're like to even ask for that environmental cue you're talking about?

Speaker 2: 13:26

Because, like, he just thinks that you've got it, you're a superhero.

Speaker 2: 13:30

It's kind of like what we do to our parents, where it's like, oh my God, our parents have emotions, like I thought they were just, like you know, invincible, and that's what happens.

Speaker 2: 13:38

Like that, I think we've got default parent as well. But I want to say this again like it is not your spouse's job to play Miss Cleo, you know it's like it's your job to manage your emotions, it's your job to communicate what you need in the moment and, on top of that, what you really need or want in the moment, like I think another great example is like when people like they have a boys night and you try, you want to be the coolest spouse, right, but you know he's had a boys night. Or you know, if you're my wife, you know a daddy daughter night, you know hanging out without me, like for four nights. And when they're like, hey, do you mind? It's like you want to be the coolest spouse or you like you just you sometimes say yes, cause you just want to be left alone, kind of thing. But then it happens, it happens and you don't say that like it's hit a limit, or you don't say that like I feel lonely or whatever, like that's not fair, that puts them in a trap.

Speaker 2: 14:31

You know what I mean and I think, like, especially with friends in really like dips, like that's really hard Because, again, you don't want to, we don't want to be controlling, we don't want to. You know, do this. But if you're not expressing your needs or your wants, your partner has no shot, no shot at all.

Speaker 3: 14:46

No shot. And then you wind up like I feel like Mike is kind of like that, like I'm very like no, like this is what I want, this is what I don't want, and he kind of in the beginning, like middle of our marriage, would compromise, Like when he would really actually want to be doing something else, and like we, then he would be like really not that happy or like aggravated while we're doing whatever we decided, and I'm like what's your problem? Like. And then I find out like oh well, I would have rather have done this, but I decided to do this for you. I'm like, no like.

Speaker 3: 15:18

I would rather you say what you want and let's do it together. It's like. It's like that same weird thing that, like Mike and I got a huge argument for when I was pregnant during Christmas, because we decided, like we're having a baby, let's save money, we're not gonna do Christmas gifts. Okay, like we had a whole conversation about it. We're not gonna do Christmas gifts, we are not doing stockings, we are doing quite literally nothing, okay.

Speaker 3: 15:45

So when I say that we're doing nothing, like we were very clear, okay, and his whole family is coming over for Christmas day to open gifts and stuff I already and all of a sudden, oh my God, all of a sudden, he's like missing on Christmas Eve because he's like a last minute shopper. And I'm like, I call him, I'm like where are you and what are you doing? Oh, I'm, you know, just getting some last minute things. And I was like, please tell me that you are not getting me Christmas gifts, like. And he was like well, you know. And I was like, no, I don't know, because I got you nothing, like I quite literally got you nothing, because we said we were doing nothing. Not a card, not a card, like nothing, nothing. So I was freaking out. I was like now I'm going to look like an asshole in front of your family because there's no gift Like I was like pretty.

Speaker 2: 16:34

I mean, I know you've known Mike's family for a while, but, right, you add factors, right, like exactly what you're saying. Like now you're worried not even about what you said to Mike, you're worried about what it looks like to everyone Because, again, marriage is also this weird game of like everyone has a judgment on it, right Like it's like you're nasty, oh, you're so mean to your spouse, or like they don't have any backstory or anyone ever.

Speaker 2: 16:56

No one will care that, like you guys said this and he just decided not to listen. All the what my poor Filipino son who did not get to yes, get any gifts from his horrible wife, I know.

Speaker 3: 17:08

And I'm like pregnant as hell. I'm like dude, and he's like I can't believe you're mad at me. I'm just trying to give you a good Christmas. I'm like Mike we talked about this Like wait, and he's like, well, you know, girls do that thing. I'm like I don't know who you think I am. You have known me since I was 14. Like there is no mind games with me. I'm like I don't have a gift for you. You're getting nothing.

Speaker 2: 17:29

Like- and I'm gonna have to handle. Thank God you have a really awesome mother-in-law Like, who was probably like I'm gonna get him nothing but-.

Speaker 3: 17:36

Oh, my God.

Speaker 2: 17:38

Like so yeah, whoever in the past, whoever maybe before you, I mean. Granted, you guys were 14. So I don't know what damage like happened, but in middle school, but potentially right, there's some sort of unwritten rule where it's like if I say that it's good and somebody else either gets in my head or be like oh bro, like you know, she says it's good, but you better have something for her for Christmas, like Right, that would like way more than like whatever conversation you mutually had. So, again, like other outside factors, outside of like what we communicated, and trusting that, when we come to the table, I'm bringing my honest emotions and you're bringing your honest emotions and we're getting to the highest possible level we can get to together for our marriage. Right, you're talking just about compromise and I actually have a very strong. People say marriage is compromise and I say BS, bullshit. I'm calling bullshit on marriage being compromised. Again, before you kill me, hear me out. I believe that compromise ends up being currency.

Speaker 3: 18:34

And I like that.

Speaker 2: 18:36

I think it becomes very dangerous. So when it's like a tip for tat, exactly, but hear me out. So, because what usually happens is compromise One person can compromise about pizza or Chinese. I wanted Chinese, but you wanted pizza, so I didn't care as much, so I just let you have the pizza. And then I do that, let's say like several times, with small things like that. And then we're about to decide I got this new job and I want to move across the country and you don't. And now we come to the table to discuss this like big life thing, and you come here and you empty out your pockets of all your compromise currency and say like I'm always doing this for you, I'm always, you know, compromising this and that. And now, right, you're trying to cash in and say like no, that doesn't happen.

Speaker 2: 19:23

And it does happen. And so what I like to say and like what I really have to actively work hard in my marriage is, like you, me and our marriage, there are three people in a marriage. Our marriage is one person and for me it's easier to think about it that way, but like it's Terry's wants, christine's wants and then the highest possible place we can get our marriage that they're. I don't feel like I'm compromising and you don't like no one feels like they're giving anything up. It's just like the highest level together that we can get, not the highest level individually, the highest level together.

Speaker 3: 19:54

And I think but that's what's so important, because that's not how culture today embrace it Like. First of all, I don't really feel like culture embraces marriage at all, but I feel like that's not how marriage is looked at today. It's very like you oriented, and I do think that's why people don't stay together. I do think that's why people fail, because they have this idea that, like me, me, me, me, me, me, me, and it doesn't work that way. And, like you said, if you compromise too much, you're gonna get resentful, you're gonna get, you know like there should be a third option.

Speaker 2: 20:28

There's what you want, your spouse wants, and then what you want together Exactly and you're married and, like I said, for me I like thinking of it as a completely separate person, because then I'm allowed to have, I can come to the table and feel so and be so incredibly selfish because then, at the end of the day, that's not, that's one piece of that like end person's decision that's gonna make right, and the reality of it is is like when you care about someone and then you hear out like I say, kari and I always come to like the table, proverbial table or, you know, island, whatever like, and I wanna know every single part of like why she's resistant to something.

Speaker 2: 21:05

Moving here is a great example, you know. Granted, she didn't have great answers, like you know. She'd like. I think she was like well, how we lived in DC before we moved up here and she's like well, how are we gonna grocery shop? She's like well, I can just walk to the grocery store now and you can. You know, kari, so you can see her saying this and I'm just like do you have anything else for me?

Speaker 2: 21:27

Like, do you have anything else for me? But right, essentially, despite how much I wanted to move and how much she didn't wanna move, that's why it took us five years and 50 extra thousand dollars. Thank you, kari. Thank you, kari. The gift that Kari keeps on giving was because I did not want her to compromise.

Speaker 2: 21:43

I wanted us to get to the highest level we could get to together. So what, it didn't take way longer than I would like it to have to do with TKIN. But reality of it is is because I didn't want, like and she's like, well, you compromise so that we stayed in DC longer for me to do this. I was like, no, I really didn't. I didn't compromise. We could not get to the highest level together, so it didn't make sense to make a move, right right.

Speaker 2: 22:08

And a lot of people are like well, like, marriage is compromise and you can't always get what you want Absolutely. But I take it out of this idea of compromise and start finding a way to get to your marriage to the highest possible level in every single small decision, from pizza and chicken to moving. Because when you do that, then there's no leftover resentment, there's no compromise currency. Think about it you know, your spouse moves across the country for you because you've got a job and you're thriving in that job and everything else. And then your spouse gets a job in Africa and now it's like okay, are you gonna pay back on that? That's not real. Like, again, like, and then you then create a situation that's like you're not on each other's team, and so that's why I really need to talk about it because we don't do it well yeah it's our end.

Speaker 3: 22:56

It all boils down to communication and actually saying what you need, saying what you want, and then going from there with the other person, like there's your timeline, your spouse's timeline and then the timeline you need to create together. And, like you, think of it as three people, I think of it as three roads. Right, it's like this road, this road and then this road that we need to take together. And I think that's important to view it that way, because if you view it as like me, me, me, that's what you're gonna wind up with, that's you're gonna be by yourself.

Speaker 2: 23:28

Quite literally. And again it's. You know what Love is not enough in marriage, Love isn't enough anywhere. Love isn't emotional. No, you know what I mean and I think too. It's just like I really wish we would stop measuring intimacy based on your sex life, because that is such a superficial level of intimacy True intimacy is found in your communication, Like that's what elevates your sex, Like this very physical thing, Like intimacy again is based on a connection. Sex is physical. Your marriage is not good or bad or in danger based on the number of times a week you are having sex.

Speaker 3: 24:08

And, to be quite honest, you would probably have it more the better communication you had. Like, like I am a person that I don't like to ask for help. I've, I wasn't raised that way. I was ready to do it on your own, whatever. But like this week I just there was things like I didn't feel like going to the store to get the Valentine's Day cards. I tried doing a pickup order and they canceled the whole thing and like, oh, I have to go to the store.

Speaker 3: 24:27

I ran out of diapers. Yeah, like I ran out of diapers for Owen. There were so many things that I just did not feel like going to the store and I asked Mike to do it and literally he was like you know problem, like I'll do it. And a couple of years ago he might be like, oh, I got all this stuff to do and like, be like, yeah, I'll do it. But like begrudgingly, I'm telling you, like that man gets, gets it. Be like he. Like I was more likely to be like when are you going to be home? I'm going to make sure I'm awake.

Speaker 2: 24:55

You brought the diapers home, let's go. And so again like, and also when, when you start to really shift from like marriage being this idealic thing and more of like a partnership in which, like you know, not 50, 50, it's never going to be 50, 50.

Speaker 2: 25:13

No, that's the number of like you know and pulse on each other Like I know, when Carrie can only give 10% I'm not, I love it, right, I'm, or like I might, whatever have you, but like I know about, about it. And it is always so much easier when we have communicated and she actually tells me what's on her mind, rather than I asked her to do something and she gives me a shitty first response and then I want to rip her face off because, as a human, the first thing I think of is everything I do and I'm like all you quite literally do is go to work. That's like your. Your responsibility is just to go to work, but like, again, that that anger doesn't get me anywhere, like anywhere closer to that.

Speaker 2: 25:53

And. But then the second she like lets me in a little bit to being like you know, I'm feeling insecure about this or whatever it is. All of a sudden, my, my capacity to handle more increases so much because, like she's the number one, I want to take care of her and I always want her to be okay, because I feel like she does that for me. But without that ability to communicate and like be on that same wavelength with her, it's just like we're against each other. F you, I'm so over your shit. I'm therapy and get out of my face, yeah.

Speaker 3: 26:26

Yeah, oh, my God, 100%. I can't even tell you like how many times. And literally the only time Mike and I really fight is when our communication is off. Oh and yeah, like, and then that's what it like really boils down to, because when your communication is off, like you're just, you're like on two different islands, I swear.

Speaker 2: 26:44

Speaking different languages from those islands and one of you might be faxing and the other one telegram, but I don't-. Yeah for real. So I'm curious to know how you guys get on the same page and then I'll I want to share before we go, just kind of like one of my tools or like what I've instituted in my marriage to kind of help us, cause I think date night every night also has like a lot of like expectations and things of that nature and while it can be fun.

Speaker 2: 27:14

I don't often think it like gets at this core root of communication and like that's. I think what every relationship needs is that time to communicate. And also, to me it's like if you're working on that communication and you guys can't get to that, like if you're actually working on communication, keeping it the focus, and it's not working, then you have like a really clear, concrete way of being, like this is not a good match, because we can't find a way, like whether it be your trauma or your triggers, whatever to communicate. If you can't work through that, then it's like time to get a third party in there that's not biased, so that you guys can either work on that communication. That's why, in my opinion, couples therapy works. It's not because I do anything magical in there, it's quite literally just a third person just throw everything down so you don't get caught in old communication patterns.

Speaker 3: 27:57

Yeah, and I will say for us to answer your question, we've been married. It'll be 12 years this summer and I will say Mike and I are very different people. He's more reserved thinks about things I would say more impulsive, more outgoing, more I mean, like you know, it's good, it's like we're ying and yang, but a lot of our coming together really took me kind of taking a step back and analyzing like things about myself that I've really needed to work on, and you know he had to do the same thing. But I think I expect a lot. I expect a lot.

Speaker 2: 28:36

I'm not someone that really like I sometimes feel like my way or the highway, like you're very direct too, I would say, was like one of the things that in our relationship together, like that you had, I felt like you did a really good job. Adjusting too was realizing that like you had to be a little softer you know what I mean Like your direct thing was directly hitting a trigger of mine like you, being so direct was directly hitting a trigger of mine. That was like I couldn't ever hear what you were saying sometimes.

Speaker 2: 29:04

Like you were like some of our. I was like calling me and you're like no, we're going to finish this and I'm like not, if you keep attacking me like this, like I'm not attacking you, I'm just telling you I'm like this isn't going to work. I was like I'm like all of the phones like why is she? She won't stop, which I think is a great like right, and I know you bring that to your marriage too, but I also I'm not saying Mike needs like a little softer side of you, but I do think right, like that, I know for our like you know you had to adapt there.

Speaker 3: 29:32

Yeah, there was. There's a level of, I would say, empathy that I needed to like acquire, and that's hard. It's hard to take a step back and look at yourself.

Speaker 2: 29:45

I just have a new perspective. You know what I mean. Like you have to try to explain the other person and whatever they did or whatever have you, rather than to step back and I think to your point earlier about like why marriages don't work. It's like most people don't want to take that step back and say like, oh shit, I have a lot of healing to do to be the best version of myself before I can even sit here and start to braid you about how to be the best version for me right.

Speaker 3: 30:12

Yeah, it's hard. I remember, like I don't know, we were probably married for like five or six years and I can't remember exactly what it was, but we were fighting a lot and I'm like I took a step back and I'm like, okay, like what is the common denominator? Like why do we keep fighting? I just don't understand. And it really took work on myself and work on me to like I wouldn't say lower my expectations, but like not give, like you can't have unrealistic expectations for your partner also, like of course you want your partner to exceed your expectations, but like giving them something unrealistic and unattainable and then getting mad at them for it, that's not gonna work either.

Speaker 2: 30:48

It's like going in love with the potential. You know what I mean. Like you can't want right. Like I want Mike to get his doctrine to, like you know, in the next three years, or whatever have you like, and you are so hung up on that.

Speaker 3: 31:01

But, again.

Speaker 2: 31:03

It's just like it's falling in love with potential and it's also. I think expectations are also part of our childhood. They're part of right. There are inner kind of narrative right. Like, why do you hold such high expectations for yourself? I bet you there's like a reason in there that has to do with something you've been through that shows that, and also most people I mean one of, for me, hidden expectations not gonna work right. Not like I need my expectations to be right out here.

Speaker 2: 31:30

I always meet your expectations. I need to know them, but most people don't take the time to know what they treat with that and then communicate them right, Like so. Did Mike even know what your expectations were, Nevermind if they were too high or not, but did? He know how high they, you know Right and that was.

Speaker 3: 31:46

That's part of the problem. So I would say, and like he was always a really good communicator, and like we also like handled we still do handle arguments very differently, but like, whereas, like he needs it solved right then and there, and like I can say that it's solved, but like I don't wanna hug and kiss you afterwards, I need like a good, like I need to simmer, because I still like I love you and like we fixed it, but I still wanna punch you in the throat. So like I need and I wonder too like A second.

Speaker 2: 32:13

I'd wonder, like I know for me too in my family, right, we'd have these big explosions and then the next minute we would be like as if nothing happened, and so it took me a really long time to realize like that was not normal fighting, like that is not normal to have those explosions, and I feel like culturally, like I could see them being like very loud and getting into it, and then the next minute, kind of adjusting back to you know and like again, it's interesting, right, two people from completely different backgrounds come together and then like, build this life together with so much baggage that you have to work through, you have to acknowledge, right, like, do you want to have the exact same marriage as your parents? Do you over-idolize that? Or you know, sometimes you don't even see, like oh wow, my parents are really codependent. Like I don't want that really for my relationship.

Speaker 2: 32:55

Or you know the opposite, you want to be so different from your parents that you bring that to your. It's so like, I guess, like in layered and complex, and that's why it's so much work, because it's not just work on the marriage, it's or the family, or the this, or the happily ever after. It's. You know, really just the beginning, in my opinion, of like finding yourself when you get into a relationship. You know, I've noticed so many times work and your biggest traumas are revealed in a relationship.

Speaker 3: 33:23

Right.

Speaker 3: 33:24

So, like you definitely have to, you have to work on yourself and you have to work on yourself with each other.

Speaker 3: 33:28

You have to be, you have to communicate, you have to like be very honest about what you want, even if you feel like it's gonna hurt your partner, like you can't. You have to be honest about it. And I think once, like I started doing that it allowed Mike to really take a step back and be like okay, like maybe these are my shortcomings in what, like she is needing or expecting from me, and it really did like turn a corner for us. And when you have a strong communication, like with each other, when you add outside factors like children or job changes or money issues or, you know, death and family or like all these other factors that like can really stress a marriage, if you're strong at your core with communication and stuff like that, like those outside factors, you're gonna get through them together and you know I think we're doing a pretty good job. I mean, I don't know he'll probably irritate me later at some point in time, but like I'm gonna keep him.

Speaker 2: 34:27

Exactly, you know, and I think too, also having that like foundation and it took me a really long time to get this through to Kerry's head is like I'm gonna hate you probably 96% of the time. Or you know, really just like you're gonna get under my nerve. I mean, what roommate really doesn't, in a sense, right? But like I need you to hear me when I say like I'm not going anywhere, like we're in this, like you know and I promise to let you know, like, yeah, there's ever a time in which, like it has gotten to a level where I was like I'm gonna communicate, like you're not gonna be blindsided. Every fight is not the fight that will end us and that made it so that we had such a better capacity to fight and truly, like you know, or like sniff at each other and no, like there's no fundamental damage being done to that.

Speaker 3: 35:13

Yeah, like you felt a safe space when you could really say what you need to say at the time, because at the end of the day, you know like it's not Going to crush your guys marriage it's got, you guys are gonna be fine you just have, you have to have a space in order to get out your truths.

Speaker 2: 35:30

Exactly and figure out a way to make those truths work together. Before before we go, I do want to share One tool that I have found very helpful and and a lot of my couples have found very helpful in terms of like communication. Again, I think we really emphasize the date night and we try to make it like big and special and that's great, you know. I think everybody should have a. If your life is busy, you know, maybe once a month date nine, schedule, what, and that'd be whatever you want, but what you can do weekly, every Wednesday, carrie and I block two hours. She gets home at like 5 30 and we block from 5 30 to 7 30 when we have like wine down we call it used to be a lot more wine than there is now. Oh, I like that. But essentially it is our time to tell each other what's really happening in our lives, go over work, because sometimes you know by the time she gets home done with coaching and stuff, like it's late and I don't want to tell her about something that happened at 7 am In the morning and she works in a school. So I'm right, we're all day long. We don't like, you know, like it's not like this whole back-and-forth communication. Or sometimes she sends me this long text about something that happens, but I don't have it in me to like go over it and we never get to connect. So this is the time where it's like we might play a board game, we might do something like that, but it's sacred time. I mean, not everyone can do 5, 7, but it is on our calendars. It's like it's called wine down, it's the expectation. We don't go to a bar, we don't. We literally come to our kitchen island, we get a drink and we're like, all right, spill it. What's going on? And again, we're not. This is that school wait to tell each other like what's what we hate about each other for that time, or anything, it's more so.

Speaker 2: 37:00

Just a time to like connect on all the things that I feel like gets missed in the hustle and bustle of a man Right like, or a hustle bustle of like carelessness, and you know, a day goes so fast and it's just like protected sacred time where we are just gonna like again connect, laugh, oh my god, did you see this reel? Or whatever, like yeah, and so it's been really, really great for us to like have that consistently. And again it's like you don't invite anyone. It's no one's over for dinner, it's not around dinner, so nobody has the pressure of, like you know, planning or getting it done. You can just kind of come, and I think adopting some version of that couldn't be a very healthy tool For anyone out there listening who's trying to be like how can I improve specifically on our communication? That's not like when it's in danger. Right, it's, this is a therapy, or you? Know, it's.

Speaker 2: 37:49

It's kind of like a maintenance to that communication, I guess I like that, I might have to start implementing that.

Speaker 3: 37:55

You're welcome, mike.

Speaker 2: 37:58

We'll be back next week for another episode of your always fine. Until then, mind your health.

Speaker 4: 38:06

Seriously, you're fine. You're fine because you have the power to access your place of peace anytime you need it. However, if you get stuck or right at the palm of your hand to help Check out our show notes for this week's source list, recommended content and cabana live group schedule, we'll catch you next week for a brand new episode of you're always fine.